Behind the Scenes with Schuyler Bull Minckler of Minckler Homes

How did you first enter the world of real estate?

I grew up going to open houses with my mom as a kid. We thought it was fun and enjoyed talking about the architecture, design choices and presentation of homes. It seems like my family was always buying or selling a home and “fixing it up." After corporate law, I wanted a few years to be home, raising my two girls. Once they started school, however, I knew it was time to get back to work and real estate was a perfect fit of working with clients on something that interested me and a flexible schedule that allowed me to balance a family and a business. 

What is the most rewarding part of your career?

To be along to help people realize their dreams, be it a first-time homebuyer, a dream horse farm or anything else. Owning a home is so much a part of our American Dream that it’s an honor to be a part of that process and along for the ride as individuals pursue their own dreams. It’s also incredibly personal. You see people at their rawest, sometimes. That’s very humbling, for me, to be trusted with that vulnerability.

What challenges exist when helping a client find their ideal horse property?

Where do I begin?! Horse property is ALWAYS challenging. It can be the challenge of budget. We’ve all heard of "champagne taste on a beer budget." That’s especially true in equine real estate. A person might want something really grand but have to scale that back to fit a budget. There are also specific challenges to equine property. It can be daunting enough to inspect a house and find out what needs to be done or maintained. Adding a barn, paddocks, fencing, outbuildings, arenas and more just heaps on potentials for risk. There are more “moving parts” in horse property. We also frequently deal with “what else goes with the property," which is really different from traditional residential real estate. Do you get the stall mats, water troughs, tractors, wheelbarrows, etc? There is a lot more to consider. Finally, the property itself may have unique features such as agricultural tax treatment, maybe conservation easements or other specific features that accompany larger parcels of land. And, of course, there’s always the ever-present “does this town/city allow horses” question!

There are a lot of aspiring horse professionals in our industry, what would be your best advice to them when it comes to selecting the property where they can run their ideal "horse business" out of?

Oh my gosh, great question! First, for professionals, I cannot stress enough the importance of creating a real business first. Getting expert advice on how to set up the business, to protect against liability, to pay proper taxes, to be set up properly and legally is probably the most important starting point. Unless you have a significant amount of independent wealth, you’re probably going to want to finance the property. Banks don’t lend based on blue ribbons. They want to know the business is going to pay its bills and be a success, so they need a plan, a proven track record and a whole lot of specific information. The individuals who understand that and know the level of detail they’re going to need to provide will be the most successful. After that, selecting a property that fits your current needs but allows for flexibility is important. In my world, this means listening to the buyer, keeping a conversation going about what it is they want to do. For instance, maybe you’re training 3-5 individuals now but know you want to expand and take on boarders in the future. Or maybe start a breeding program. It’s worth the time up front to think in the short term (what do I need today/right now); one year out and then five years out. Buying a property that is too small for what you want in five years is going to be frustrating if you need to move just as you’re getting your business under way. On the flip side, buying something too large in the hopes your business will expand may bankrupt you before you get a chance to really build, so you need to balance where you are with where you want to be and find something that fits your specific goals and plans. 

How did you get into real estate, and more importantly the 'horse property' end of real estate?

I started in residential real estate in Colorado. There, we had hundreds if not thousands of homes in a development with TINY yards. It’s hard for New Englanders who haven’t been out west to imagine the type of development. I started there, buying and selling in the neighborhood where we lived. After meeting a neighbor and chatting about horses one day, they admitted that they had dreamed of owning “horse property," and we began searching for something for them to retire to. Along the way, my husband and I found a property that didn’t suit the client but that we fell in love with. Our two girls were just beginning to really get into riding multiple days a week and the trainer had already suggested leasing a horse for them. Well, the rest was history, as we bought our first farm, built a “dream barn,” and started down the path of horse ownership. Once people saw our farm, they wanted one too. As more people found out what I did, more clients literally just started calling. It just “happened," or so it seemed to me. I already knew the horse side of things! From the real estate side, I learned a lot more about water rights, mineral rights and so on (big deal out west!) and then just took off. When I moved back east, I was surprised to find so few individuals specializing in this area and decided to truly focus my efforts in equine real estate. I approached a few larger facilities and began marketing those as well. Friends and neighbors saw what we did with our second barn, which we built from the ground up, and asked how they could do something similar. Equine real estate is a true passion for me, so I tend to get more into it and work more closely with my clients. Many have become really good friends and then they have told their friends about me. As most readers here know, the horse community is a pretty small world!

Can obtaining financing for a commercial horse property present challenges? If so, what steps can be taken to bridge those gaps?

Short answer, of course it presents challenges! Longer answer, again, start with good professionals early on. People talk about “getting a mortgage” or “financing” and I think many folks think this is a one-size-fits-all situation. Borrowing money is like saying you’re going to buy a shirt. There are all kinds of shirts. They come in a range of prices and fabrics. Loans are the same. What an individual needs to get a loan depends on so many factors. When advising buyers, I usually recommend they speak to a variety of lenders. Some people buy “horse property” with a conventional loan. It’s not all that different from a traditional residential loan. Others work with a specific agricultural lender or seek business loans. A lucky few work with “private financing” which comes in myriad shapes and sizes. It also depends on the specific horse property. So much depends on what the property offers and what type of borrowing the buyer is going to use. A general answer, however, is have your financial documents in order. The lender is going to want to know what sort of income you’ve been making for several years. They’re going to want copies of your tax returns. Some people buy a property to operate as a business but have a partner/spouse who works in a different business and can help support the loan. For younger trainers, a bank usually needs to see multiple years of self-employed income, so saying you made $X last year won’t carry much weight unless it was the same amount as prior years. Getting good financial and lending advice is always the first step towards buying a horse property!

Do you have any specific recommendations for anyone looking to purchase their ideal horse property?

Utilize professionals and make sure they can network you with other professionals. Whether you start with the business advisors, real estate professionals, or lending seek advice and explain to the professionals what it is you want to achieve. Many of us can be creative, and often I work with people 6-12 months before we actually find the property that fits their needs. Part of this is because of the uniqueness of the property, but part of it is also because it can take a while to lay the groundwork to get a buyer ready to buy, or a seller ready to sell for that matter. Discuss what you want with the real estate professional. I usually ask, “what is your dream property” and “what is your discipline?" Horse folks have VERY different criteria for what they want and expect in barns, fencing and amenities. Maybe you’re going to retire a few older show horses and trail ride occasionally. If your plans are to operate a Hunter/Jumper show facility, that is going to look different from the Reining facility a few towns over. Figuring out how the property is going to be utilized and/or what needs to be altered to accommodate that use can help determine if a property is suitable for that buyer. For instance, the property may have a lovely 12 stall barn, outdoor arena and indoor arena. But the arena is too short for a six stride line or for an indoor polo arena.How a buyer wants to use that property is going to change how they see it. If they need to pay for feet and feet of fencing just to start up their lesson program, that’s an out of pocket expense. If the indoor is too small for their intended use, it can be very expensive to expand, if not impossible based on zoning and other building rules. Know what you need and express that to your professionals and work together. It will make life much smoother in the long run. Also, consider what you need to start and what you can build down the road. It’s very rare to find absolutely EVERYTHING you want in a horse property. Building or expanding is almost always a part of the process, but knowing what to build and how much it’s going to cost is challenging to assess without good advice. 

When it comes to financing, do you work with specific lenders who can finance these properties? 

Absolutely. As noted above, there are a variety of lenders, depending on what the buyer intends to do. As a real estate professional, I love connecting buyers and lenders to find the best solution.

What steps can an aspiring horse farm owner take to set themselves up for success prior to purchasing a property?

Do your homework and surround yourself with good professionals. Horses are expensive, even if it’s a sweet old pony in the backyard. There are unique liability exposures that you want to be protected from. If you’re looking to operate a business, keep good financial books. For everyone, learn as much as you can about what you want ahead of time, so you will know what you need once you’ve purchased. Whether looking at buying for business or pleasure, a lot of thought goes into horse property. For instance, local zoning rules may dictate some of where you can place structures like barns, indoor arenas and sometimes even outdoor arenas and paddocks. What type of barn are you interested in? Stalls attached to an indoor? Do you want storage for hay and shavings? Do you need a grain room? Where will utilities run? Are they going to be metered separately from the house or off the home's utilities? All of these play a part of how your business will be structured and what it will cost if you do end up building something from the ground up or buying something already in place. Who is going to handle the day-to-day work of the operation? Will there be employees or is the buyer going to do most of it? Is this going to be personal or a business? What type of liability does that open the buyer up to? Should there be a business entity created as part of the process? Is additional insurance needed when animals are going to be on site. There are so many things to consider! Having a knowledgeable professional can help untangle some of these, and having someone who knows where to direct you for good advice is paramount. 

What are your thoughts on the direction of the market going forward? 

The crystal ball question! For properties where the home is still a majority of the property value (typical residential home with smaller barn, a few paddocks, etc.), the market is still strong for the areas I work (MA, NH and soon CT) because there is a shortage of residential homes for sale overall, lower interest rates and available credit. Larger residential lots are becoming more and more rare, so for those looking to build an at-home "dream barn" options are fewer and further between. Existing properties with smaller barns and traditional residential homes will continue to appeal to those dis-satisfied with the more urban areas, especially if COVID concerns continue to drive people out of the cities. 

The larger facilities in good condition with proven business are unique, and COVID brought a huge boon to “horse properties” this spring. We saw a jump in demand for larger properties as buyers sought out “compounds” where they could have personal space and room for expanded family members. I’d love to say that this trend will continue, but I really think we will see more of a leveling out, as we were in a declining market prior to the COVID “boost." Facilities, like other luxury residential properties, appeal to a much smaller buyer pool, and it becomes more about “fit” and good marketing. We will likely see a few properties go quickly and/or for over asking, especially if it’s a proven business. We've already seen a number of investors who are leery of our stock markets and are willing to invest in a local business that survived COVID shut-downs. This trend could continue into 2021, for the “right” properties. On the flip side, for the properties already in decline, I’d say the future is challenging. My gut says buyers are going to be very concerned with deferred maintenance issues, as we’re already seeing more-educated buyers who are asking about costs of footing and fencing at first showings. As the costs to bring a property back into use increase, the offer price tends to decrease. Coupled with concerns about our current economic outlook as a country, I’d say we could easily be facing a less rosy future for “farm” properties as a whole. Larger properties already tend to be in more rural areas with further commutes to employment, shops and so on. For many buyers, this decreases the property's desirability. So, bottom line, a horse property in good shape will continue to enjoy a strong market into 2021, but struggling properties may actually see a downward trend.